How can we be brave and embrace conflict?

Farra Trompeter: Welcome to the Smart Communications Podcast. This is Farra Trompeter, co-director and worker-owner at Big Duck. Today, we’re going to ask the question: How can we be brave and embrace conflict? And I am delighted to be joined by Altagracia Montilla. I’ll tell you a little more about her in a moment. I met her actually at a networking event that Big Duck hosted last year, following a day-long workshop we did on donor communications planning. She came by our happy hour. I was intrigued. She, at the time, also had some colored hair, which she does not right now. Promises me may return. And we started talking, and we had recently launched an episode on the podcast, number 194 with Keyante Love, How can you communicate with candor and care? And as I was talking with Altagracia, it was clear that she had some additional thoughts that would be interesting. So we invited her to join us.

Farra Trompeter: I’ll tell you a little bit about her. She does use she/her pronouns, and Altagracia is the founder of AM Consulting, co-founder of The 7 Space, Art Gallery and Wellness Center, and creator of Freedom Readers, a global book club for freedom dreamers. With over a decade of experience across nonprofit education and corporate spaces, she designs relationship-centered strategies and transformative experiences that strengthen connection and collective wellbeing. Altagracia, welcome to the show.

Altagracia Montilla: Thank you so much for having me.

Farra Trompeter: Well, as part of your work to support people in organizations, you’ve created a practice that you call Conflict Bravery™. And that practice helps teams heal their relationship to conflict so it can deepen relationships and drive meaningful change. Let’s start there. That’s my understanding–you can tell us if that’s right. But also, really, what led you to develop Conflict Bravery™?

Altagracia Montilla: Yeah, so what led me to Conflict Bravery™ was being caught in between what I knew and was raised to understand about conflict, and where I was, which is the nonprofit sector, and recognizing that that wasn’t what was there wasn’t working for me. So I grew up in the South Bronx. I don’t know if you’ve heard of a nice, nice, cute place called the South Bronx…

Farra Trompeter: You heard of it, you know us Brooklynites, we do travel.

Altagracia Montilla: Yes, yes. Good, good, good. You know, because some folks won’t make it that far north. So yeah, so I grew up in the South Bronx, and you know, what that means is I grew up in a space where there was a lot of scarcity. And because of that, there, you know, were people who were present, who were willing to, you know, defend all that they knew and all that they had. And sometimes that looks like only having their name or their legacy or their reputation. And so I grew up in a space where I saw conflict aggression, and I saw conflict seeking, you know, as a form of dealing with tension and conflict.

Altagracia Montilla: Fast forward to me being in the nonprofit sector, where I was oftentimes the youngest, the only woman, or person of color who was leading a team and I believe in driving change, and I want to see change happen, but I also recognize that in the spaces that I was working in, conflict avoidance was the norm. And so I was caught in between, “Okay, I grew up in this like conflict aggressive space that isn’t going to help me create the change that I want to change and isn’t going to be aligned with the person I want to be in this world and this lifetime.” And then conflict avoidance wasn’t also giving what it needed to give, right? It wasn’t supporting the work.

Altagracia Montilla: So I came up with a framework that allowed us to think of conflict in a very generative way. Not to be afraid of conflict, but to use it as a way to nurture our relationships and move us towards the vision of the kind of world community, you know, that we want to build. So Conflict Bravery™ allows us to think of conflict using what I call a sustainability praxis, where instead of throwing conflict away, we say, “Ooh, like how can I use this conflict? You know, what is this conflict trying to tell me?” Let’s, like, use it to nurture the soil of our relationships and our work.

Farra Trompeter: Well, let’s talk a little more about that and that connection to community you just mentioned. How do you see confronting these conflicts, internal conflicts, you know, interrelated conflicts, conflicts that people have with each other, with systems beyond our community? How does all of this conflict confrontation, right? (And that spirit of conflict aggression, and conflict avoidance), So you’ve got, you know, conflict confrontation, you’re bringing in through conflict bravery. How does that help someone?

Altagracia Montilla: Yeah, so I love the way you frame that question because you’re naming the different layers that we can experience when it comes to conflict. We have, like, that inner conflict, interpersonal conflict with this, conflict in self, which could look like conflict with ideas, ideology. We have conflict within our relationships with people and that extra layer is that extra personal conflict. So conflict with an institution, you know, society norm, it could be a physical space or place in all those levels. When we work with conflict in a way that is generative, it creates new ways of being and allows us to fulfill our full potential.

Altagracia Montilla: When it comes to self, that looks like being more confident. It looks like having a strong sense of self. It looks like being more fluid and changing ideas, when we know who we are. In our relationships, it looks like, you know, I always say that a relationship isn’t living to its full potential until it’s conflict brave, right? So when we have a relationship with someone where it’s okay to engage in conflict, we’re able to, like, really deepen that relationship. And when it comes to like systems–that extra personal conflict–when we bring conflict bravery to that space where we have the capacity to create change for more belonging, the capacity to create change for innovation and creativity. So, you know, it unlocks the full potential of what we could be.

Farra Trompeter: Love it. I love the joy that comes through as you talk about conflict, which is not always the case for people.

Altagracia Montilla: You’re right. Thank you so much for seeing me, for feeling it.

Farra Trompeter: I see it. I feel it. I bet people can hear it. You know, conflict is hard. What do you find are the biggest barriers to get people or nonprofit organizations to name the tensions, to be more honest with one another, and to also share accountability for what’s happening?

Altagracia Montilla: Yeah, for one, I will say the greatest barrier or struggle is fear. It’s fear. And this is why the healing part of Conflict Bravery™ is so important, and what is often missing in discussions about conflict or candor is that healing piece, right? We think about conflict, and when I explore conflict with folks, they’re oftentimes moving from a space, a place where they’re thinking about their earliest examples of conflict. And you know, I’ve heard many stories, as you can imagine, Farra. So everything from “I saw, you know, my parents fight in the household” or “I’d not”, or “Not at all.” That’s also a challenge, right? Or seeing certain experiences in school. Another one that comes up a lot is folks in their relationship with institutions. Conflict is a threat to status quo. So institutions, especially those that have a history of being oppressive, are threatened by conflict and also create this norm that conflict is something that can only be one-sided, where those who have more power over others are the ones who can bring tension to the space and to the room.

Altagracia Montilla: And so folks are carrying that weight with them when they’re thinking about conflict and that discomfort that comes–it’s a somatic experience really, before we even think about it–so that discomfort that comes into their bodies, they’re afraid of that. You want to know what’s scarier than the discomfort. It’s what’s at stake, right? When we do not engage in conflict in generative ways, we lose money, is one thing, right? There was a study that was done that showed organizations and corporations collectively lose up to $600 billion in a year. Just to conflict. The time spent on conflict, the energy spent on conflict, on average, there’s three hours per person, per week lost to conflict.

Altagracia Montilla: Another challenge is that we see physical impact that conflict avoidance even can have on folks, or conflict aggression within the workplace. We have seen in a particular workplace where there was a staff that was experiencing extreme hair loss, weight gain, tooth loss. I hate to say it, but that showed up, too. And this was from a space, a nonprofit space that was conflict-avoidant. They were holding the tension in their bodies as opposed to creating safety to let it out. And most spaces aren’t that extreme in what they’re dealing with, of course, but there is always like this spectrum, we’re falling on the spectrum of that, right? So it’s holding that. If it’s not that extreme, sometimes it’s holding it and bringing it home and not being able to sit still, or our nervous system being dysregulated, or not being able to focus at the dinner table with our families, right? So that fear comes up, which is why I believe in bringing joy into this space.

Farra Trompeter: There you go. And you’re doing it.

Altagracia Montilla: That’s right.

Farra Trompeter: Well, let’s talk about organizations that do that because you’re painting a picture certainly of people. And again, on that spectrum, some ways, you really can tell if an organization’s conflict avoidant; you might be able to see it in people and how they’re interacting. On the flip side, on that other end of the spectrum, what does it look like to see an organization that does embrace conflict as part of their culture? What’s a hallmark of that? You see, you know, an organization’s doing that when…

Altagracia Montilla: Yeah. See, I’m getting excited again! So when we see organizations that are conflict brave I notice a couple things. (1) Feedback is a normal part of the way that folks function, and people are excited to receive feedback, to solicit feedback. There are regular check-ins that allow folks to name and share who they are, beyond their titles. There are regular check-ins and seasons, as I will call them, for unpacking challenges that are happening within the workplace. There is ease in folks’ bodies, right? In the nonprofit space, this is where I see this the most. There are oftentimes persons who will be nervous about sending an email because they’re afraid of how it’ll land. So, in a space where there is conflict bravery, you see folks are able to just speak as they speak in an email, you know, as they show up in a space, there is continuous improvement happening regularly. There is innovation that’s happening. People are comfortable taking risks and are willing to go there when it comes to their relationship with each other. So I also think they are more joyful spaces. You know, that’s just me, Farra.

Farra Trompeter: Yeah, you’re bringing it. Bring it. We like joy. We had another podcast with my friend and a former client, Elandria Jackson Charles, talking about how can we embrace joy. We’ll be sure to link to that episode, too, in the transcript for this. We’ll bring the joy into the conflict. This is what it’s about. Well, on that note, what tips do you have for people who are trying to embrace this Conflict Bravery™ and get the courage to say the things that need to be said? Do the things that need to be done. You know, let’s imagine someone’s listening, whether it’s for themselves in their workplace, a workplace they’re leading, or just even in their own personal relationships. They’re ready to be brave. How can they do that?

Altagracia Montilla: So there are a few things that I would name that are most important, instead of my long list of things that I want to offer, of course. You know, the Conflict Bravery™ experience usually happens in three core sections. One is healing our relationship to conflict. The second is reprogramming our relationship to conflicts and taking on the identity of becoming conflict brave. And another third is to practice. So I would offer to folks listening: (1) Think about your earliest examples of conflict and compare that to your most recent, and make the connection between why you showed up the way that you do now, like what has led to that? Offer yourself comfort, ease, and kindness as you forgive yourself in using the practice that has gotten you to this point.

Altagracia Montilla: (2) I would say time to welcome the language of conflict bravery, talk about it all the time. “I can’t wait to be conflict brave. I’m conflict brave. I’m aspiring to be conflict brave. I want this relationship, this workplace, this team to be conflict brave,” right? Like, really normalizing that. I would say also practicing that looks like asking folks for feedback and not just in the workplace, but when you go home to the people you love, whether it be your kids, your friends, your family, your romantic partner, your parents. Asking, “How have I shown up as a community member, as a friend?” et cetera. And receiving that feedback, letting it sit in the body, see how you sit with it, reflect on it, and think about what can change. Similarly, the same things can happen within the workplace. I also believe in doing what I call “mental cardio” to allow us to massage our capacities and make it easier to show up differently. So what that looks like with conflict bravery, because we have a somatic response to conflict, it also helps us to engage in different activities or behaviors that allow a little bit of that somatic experience to happen, in a safe way. So that mental cardio for conflict bravery looks like trying new experiences regularly. Like maybe write a list of like 10 things you haven’t done, but you can do, I don’t know, in any given week.

Farra Trompeter: Your conflict brave bucket list.

Altagracia Montilla: Oh yeah, exactly.

Altagracia Montilla: That, and once a week, just do one of those things and just notice how your body feels and reflect on it. And that allows you to kind of build that somatic capacity to be present in those moments where you need to be conflict brave.

Farra Trompeter: Love it. Well, if you’re out there and you’d like to learn more about Altagracia’s work, including the Conflict Bravery™ Masterclass she teaches, go to AltagraciaMontilla.com. You can also find her on LinkedIn, on Threads and Instagram. We’re going to link to all of this in the show notes at BigDuck.com/insights. Before we go, Altagracia, anything else you’d like to share with our listeners that’s coming up for you in this conversation?

Altagracia Montilla: I would say you are doing some of the most important work, at least in my opinion, right? That there is, and you’re creating a meaningful change in this world. And comfort with conflict is necessary to create that change. So be kind to yourself as you’re on this journey, and let this be the moment where you start to say, “You know what? I’m going to be a little more conflict brave in this world.” And for that, thank you.

Farra Trompeter: There you go. Well, thank you so much, and everyone, be brave out there.